Grey primer

[Vekiq]

Hi All,

I have posted few times and its questions, questions and more questions, sorry about that guys, but hopefully i will get to the stage where i will be able to offer some advice, i am still learning

Should i use grey primer (or different one) if i am to handbrush with enamel paints?

Cheers

 

[dubster72]

Hey don't worry about the questions! For the guys on here, it's a pleasure to help & we all need to ask stuff, no matter how experienced we are. Personally, I wouldn't bother priming before using enamels. This is because I've found them to 'flow' better than oils or acrylics & they cover any surface better too.

What I would always advise is to wash whatever is to be painted in warm soapy water first. This isn't just to remove skin oils that may have been deposited during construction but also the 'mould release' agents used at the factory. They can cause all kinds of problems with paint, often a 'cracked/crazy paving' look that only shows when the paint is dry! :censored2

All the best Patrick

 

[Vekiq]

great, cheers.

 

[Caledonia]

Hi again, As Patrick says above, enamels usually go on O.K. without primer, but I always use a primer as it shows up all those errors and gives you a chance to correct them if necessary. But it's down to personnel preference like most things.

If you search this site, you will see a lot of people use a Halford Primer with great success. I have no experience of this, I use Tamiya Fine Surface Primer, it comes in grey and white, I tend to use the white, as the first time I used the grey, it was a near perfect match for the Trumpeter Kits grey plastic I was building, so it was difficult to see.

All the best Derek

 

[radish1us]

Here's something to think about when next using a primer, firstly most people grab for a GREY primer, NOW WHY USE THIS COLOUR ?

Grey, is made from the two most violent colours in the colour spectrum, ie, black and white, so why use it at all ?

It takes a couple of top colour coats, to just hide this grey colour, it's OK for getting depth of paint onto something like a car, so it can be polished back to a high gloss, but why TRY TO DO THAT to a model ?

If your going to use a single colour as a primer on a model, then think of the most neutral and natural colour that is on the planet, SAND, don't believe me eh, just look around the room where your now sitting. How many different shades of sand, are right near you now ?

This stuff will cover the dreaded red plastic, with just one easy thin coat of primer and then you can even use a single thin white top gloss coat over the sand colour. By using a MATT "colour" as a primer, you only need that one thin gloss coat to cover, now the matt paint has tiny imperfactions in the surface that takes the gloss from it, these imperfections are an excellent base, for the single gloss top coat to adhere too.

DO NOT knock it, until you have actually tried it out, serious doubters have become instant converts to this idea, once they have tried it out.

If you want to use a top gloss coat of say a green colour, then use a single matt primer coat of a similiar green colour, this will produce a rich green colour, that on a model, looks just right. You can expand this colour choice of matt undercoats, to whatever colour top coat your going to use.

This sand colour I use is, TESTORS Matt Sand, followed by a top coat of whatever colour enamel paint I care to use, sometimes I might use Testors enamel, other times I will use Dulux paints, straight from the hardware store, it's cheaper and there's lots more for the buck, if you get my drift.

I only use the cheapest form of carrier with the enamel paints to, Mineral Turpentine, works wonderfully well and it's cheap.

If you want to use acrylics, then it works just as well, as what it does for enamels, the "only difference is", the acrylics require a polishing to get them to look correct, so avoid that $hite like the plague, if possible.

 

[dubster72]

Just a quick point here, and not to knock mr radish but there's 2 reasons military modellers use black or white as a primer colour. One is if you want to pre-shade a kit, then black is a good choice, and white reflects the light passing through the top coats-it's why car manufacturers undercoat cars in white. And for the record-white & black as 'violent' colours? So not day-glo pink then? lol Patrick

 

[stona]

Is grey a violent colour? I use grey (or sometimes white) for the same reason as most modellers. It covers well, the paint I use adheres well to the plastic providing a stable base for my camouflage coats and shows any flaws in my seams etc that need fixing whilst it is still a relatively simple job. These light primers also pose no problems when over spraying with "difficult" colours like yellow.

If I preshade I use Mal Mayfield's same colour technique (maybe for another thread).

I think the sand idea sounds perfectly reasonable, there are many ways of skinning a cat, and it obviously works for radish1us.

I'm not sure what the last point re: acrylics means. I usually polish my primer coat (lightly,I don't want a glassy surface) then spray my acrylic coat. For an aircraft finish I rarely need to polish this before applying my gloss coat,decals,weathering and finally the varnish to give me the finish I'm after. I do a lot of Luftwaffe so this is often a silk finish verging toward glossy (very subjective, depends a lot on subject/references!)

Surely the most important function of the primer is to provide a stable base for the later coats,whatever they are. I've been using Halfords plastic primer for years. I once removed a botched Sky underside (acrylic) from a model using some pretty harsh solvents and tools ( ammonia/meths/toothbrush,you get the picture) and the primer was undamaged. That's what I'm after.

Coming back to the original question, I always used to prime before spraying enamel paints but many people don't and achieve fantastic results. I think it's safe to say that it is not necassary. I would always prime before applying acrylic paints, they just don't adhere to the bare plastic as well in my opinion.

Cripes that's a long post - off for a lie down.

Cheers

Steve

 

[Fenlander]

I prefer, for no other reason than it being water soluble, Acrylic paint. Even the little pots that come with Airfix 'starter sets' are fine for brush painting. However, I totally agree from my early findings that painting straight onto the plastic is not a great idea. Even though I knew the plastic was clean, I got patches where the paint did not cover and 'pulled back' leaving clear patches.

I went into Wilkos (Wilkinsons) and picked up tin each of white and grey primer spray cans for just over £3 each. After a light spray on my second kit and quite a bit of water thinning of the little pots of paint, the difference in the finish is amazing. Just my brush painting that lets it down lol. So I would certainly use spray primer. All down to personal taste though I suppose.

 

[jspitza]

ModelMaster Primer-Grey. I thin with ModelMaster thinner in very diluted mixtures70-80% ratio thinner to paint -spray 5 PSI max to create a very fine mist This barely coats the entire surface except small parts and cockpits. This ensures that my modelmaster acryls don't lift up with tape. Without the gray enamal primer, the acryl paint is useless. This primer coat is thin, I could carry the part out of the spray booth if required to the fast drying nature of thinning paints. HTH-Jeff