Ho229B Nachtjager 1/48 DML

[treyzx10r]

This one has been in the stash a long time and I've put off building it ,mainly due to reported fit issues. The usual start at the office



I made some harness straps from painted strips of masking tape and then added some left over P/E bits from the spares box.





The intake tubes seemed long to me so I cut them down a bit







Test dry fitting of the nose cone seemed sketchy so I added some small square stock to act as an alignment guide. I filed an angle on the top surfaces of the square stock to avoid fit issues



The fuse fit so far seems okay,things will soon tell when the sub assemblies go together ,or not. Hoping past reviews I've read about the ill fits somehow wo'nt manifest themselves.







I'm going to take some liberties with the paint scheme as this is a what if Luft 46 subject anyway,cheers Trey

 

[ojays]

Looking forward to your rendition of this!

Gregg

 

[Polux]

Wow! The "office" looks magnificent Trey!

I'm glad to follow an other of your excellent builds

 

[stona]

That is most definitely an excellent start. You've got me intrigued as to what your 'what iffery' colour scheme might be

Cheers

Steve

 

[treyzx10r]

Greg ,Polux thanks. Steve thanks ! I was really hoping you would be of help in that arena. I have some pics of damaged late JU 88's with some crazy looking 'fish net schemes' with a combo of mottling ,of course all in black and white. Any idea or suggestion as to what colors were in use at the time?

 

[stona]

They usually used the standard fighter colours, particularly RLM 75 and 76. Some had a base of 75 with the 'squiggle' 76 applied over it. Others were overall 76 with a mottle of 75. Sometimes the pattern is so heavy that it is difficult to be sure which is the base colour. At times some or all the lower surfaces were painted black. The variations are almost endless so you really can't go wrong with a Luft '46.

What about swastikas? They were meant for vertical surfaces and though some of the Hortens' early, civil registered, gliders had them out on the wing (where the balkenkreuz would be expected on a Luftwaffe aircraft) I'm not sure whether they would have been applied or not.

Cheers

Steve

 

[treyzx10r]

Thanks Steve,was wondering about the Swastikas as well ,came across this photo



was unsure if it was authentic or not. Appreciate your input as always you're a wealth of great info thanks again,cheers Trey

 

[papa 695]

Great star Trey I'm watching this one unfold

 

[ojays]

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Different airframes I know, but thought some of these schemes may be of interest.
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Gregg

 

[ojays]

Looks like something out of Indiana Jones with those swastika's

 

[stona]

Thanks Steve,was wondering about the Swastikas as well ,came across this photo

was unsure if it was authentic or not. Appreciate your input as always you're a wealth of great info thanks again,cheers Trey

I'm pretty sure the Americans put that on post war.

Cheers

Steve

 

[ojays]

Just been browsing one of the F/B Luftwaffe sites I frequent and found this really unusual schemes you might like.

No idea what the colours would be as it looks like Joseph And His Amazing Techni-Colour Dreamcoat Colours.

A Do 217 Nightfighter.

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[Airfix Modeller Freak]

I 've always liked the Horten. I always have been greatly interested in the luftwaffe machines that never made it beyond the prototype or drawing board. These aircraft were truly revolutionary, and the horten was the first aircraft to have radar stealth tech. If this aircraft had reached full scale production, the germans could have won the war. This arcraft was truly beyond it's time.

John

 

[liberator61]

was,nt the Horton the forerunner on which the Americans based there stealth bombers and fighters after finding the last example in a mueseum store room not on display but just sitting there gathering dust.

 

[Airfix Modeller Freak]

was,nt the Horton the forerunner on which the Americans based there stealth bombers and fighters after finding the last example in a mueseum store room not on display but just sitting there gathering dust.

The horten actually had stealth capability. This was researched by Grumann in the US just recently. They built an accurate replica of the real horten kept at the Smithsonian and based on the WW2 standard radar Britain and the allies possessed, they discovered that the Horten would had been technically invisible to the allies radar. Additionally, it’s superior speed and manoeuvrability outperformed any fighters of that day and age. However, the Americans did base the F-117 Nighthawk and the B-2 Spirit on the Horten 229. Interestingly, Werner von Braun, the revolutionary inventor and German scientist who was reponsible for the V1 and V2 weapons, worked for the US after the war in developing the Space program and Missiles.

John

 

[stona]

The Horten would not have been invisible to British radar in any normal operation. Most importantly the Grumman engineers only tested the materials of nose cone in establishing that the materials used in this laminated structure did indeed attenuate the reflected radar signal. They then came up with figures, using a full size mock up, based on the aircraft approaching the British coast at speed and an altitude below 100' which implied it would be considerably less visible than a Bf 109 (at what altitude we are left to guess). This is hardly surprising as a Bf 109 approaching at 50 -100 feet would in fact be invisible to chain home radar. Mosquitos doing the same thing the other way were just as invisible to German radars. This is a function of early radar, not the aircraft.

Incidentally the mock up is rather crude. It does not contain the substantial metal tubular frame about which a real Ho 229 was constructed for example. Jet engines were represented by thin plate. It was not finished in original lacquers and the surface finish is one of the critical elements in stealth technology.



All the Grumman tests really demonstrated was that some elements of the Ho 229's construction did possess properties that might attenuate the aircraft's radar signature and that the shape had a lower overall signature for an aircraft of this size, largely due to the lack of a fin or propellers. To state that the aircraft was truly stealthy is a somewhat wild extrapolation of the limited data.

The Horten's potential invisibility is one of those internet myths that has grown into a 'fact' by repetition. It did have a relatively lower radar signature but there were no intentional stealth features built into the Horten design and that includes the surface finish which was standard RLM (Warnecke and Bohm) lacquers. The presence of supposedly radar defeating elements in some of the bonding materials used in the construction of the Horten aircraft is likewise coincidental.

Time lines are important here. When the design was made radar was a VERY new technology and any thoughts of defeating it by stealth were well in the future. The tailess gliders the Hortens (and others like Lippisch) built, which are the direct ancestors of the jet powered 'flying wings', predate radar by several years.

The first claim for any stealth features in the Horten wings was made by one of the brothers, in Argentina, AFTER stealth technology was being developed in the US, something he was aware of. He even claimed to have deliberately added conducting materials to the bonding materials at this time.

The moral of this story is be careful in trusting the recollections a Nazi aircraft designer, particularly when he is still designing aircraft and may have a vested interest in appearing to have been further ahead of the game than he actually was.

Cheers

Steve

 

[treyzx10r]

Gregg thanks for all the great pics,appreciate you taking the time to post them. Steve thanks for the fascinating back story and clearing up some of the myth surrounding this Wing.

I'm still undecided about the scheme as of yet. Spent most of the day dealing with the fit issues,they were out quite a bit. I was able to manipulate the parts so that 90% of the of the gaps were on the underside. I filled the large gaps with thick ca followed by some good ole green putty. I also decided to paint the starter engine fairings white and used cut up straws to mask them off while spraying the steel color.

 

[yak face]

Brilliant stuff Trey , I love to watch a real 'knife fight' of a build like this! Its great to see the ways used to overcome problems and i think its something that keeps a modellers skills honed , having to use their initiative and resourcefulness, not to mention patience and stamina!!! Great start on the cockpit and the body is looking good , ive got every confidence that the fit issues will be overcome . keep the updates coming , cheers Tony

 

[stona]

I agree with Tony and it's obvious that you have made a fine job of overcoming the reluctance of the kit to go together properly. It looks really nice and clean and what a shape it is. Whatever the technical limitations of the Horten design it is amazing that seventy plus years later it still looks futuristic. It must be the Lamborghini Countach of the aeroplane world

Did you know that the Hortens never really overcame the problem of steering the thing? Without going into the aerodynamics, their solution was to use 'drag rudders', that is devices to slow down one side of the aeroplane to rotate it, an inelegant and inefficient solution. Lippisch, who I believe was a better theoretical aerodynamicist, couldn't figure the problem out either. The design he developed from his tailless gliders, did have a fin and conventional rudder. That was the Me 163 of course. The problem wasn't solved theoretically until the 1960s and practically on the B-2 bomber in the 1970s, though not many saw the result until sometime in the 1980s.

Cheers

Steve

 

[dubster72]

I'm with Tony, this is an informative build with Steve's knowledge & your modeling skills Trey.

Plus it's telling me this is definitely not a kit for me to attempt just yet!