What's with my a/b

[dubster72]

Balderdash!


Noxious vapours? Use a mask / spray booth (recommended for whatever paint types you use!)


Multiple acrylic paint brands = an empty wallet (especially including buying their proprietary thinners & cleaners)


It takes no longer to flush enamels than acrylics to start on a new colour.


Drying time... you've got me there, but I prefer to allow paint to cure rather than dry.


Acrylics are more popular granted, but when do you see an enamel user saying " my tip is clogging! ", or " my paint is splattering "?


Enamels : the past, present & future of great painting! ™

 

[Adrian "Marvel" Reynolds]

Can't teach an old dog new tricks !!!!!


If enamels were that good professional builders like Steve Sutcliffe and Phil Flory would use them surely?


Embrace the diversity !!!

 

[Robert1968]

Try getting an Iwata Revolution as a minimum if you can if you are thinking of another AB.
John

Looking at Revolution what type though


I want dual control but hare side feeders hence why I have my neo ( sh### ) oops sorry bout that


Revolution what type please


Regards Robert

 

[stona]

Well as one who has used both I think it is quite possible to get great results with both. I will also carry with me to the grave the notion that enamels are more forgiving of approximate thinning etc than are acrylics. This is lucky for me because approximate could well be my middle name! I thin my paints by eye and feel. Many paints, even from the same manufacturer, require different amounts of thinning making it impossible ever to give anything other than approximate advice for ratios.


The point about having to clean the tip above is a case in point. You won't see posts from enamel users suffering this sort of problem. I actually can't remember the last time I suffered from a blockage, runs, splurges, splatters or any other unfortunate event when spraying enamel paints. I did with acrylics, but they could be minimised by careful thinning and addition of flow enhancer and more importantly retarder. It shouldn't be a deal breaker for someone wanting to use acrylics.


Drying time is utterly irrelevant to me. The one thing I try never to do at any stage of building a model is to rush. Rushing almost guarantees a visit from captain cock-up


Each person has to balance the pros and cons of each type and both rather obviously have both. There is no right or wrong, it's what works best for you and your situation. If you are spraying in the spare bedroom above your kitchen I can think of several good reasons why enamels might not be for you. Butter flavoured with a hint of White Spirits wouldn't do it for me either


You really should be using some form of extraction and protective mask whatever you spray. Just because you can't smell it don't mean it ain't there. You can smell the solvent base of enamel paints and not usually acrylic paints, but both create an aerosol laden with paint droplets when sprayed and these particulates should not be inhaled on a regular basis.


I was given some good advice on pressures by a quite well known airbrush artist, you will have seen his work on album covers of the 1970s in particular. I spray at around 35-40 psi which is actually slightly lower than his recommendation. It works for me. Again airbrushes vary as does the medium being sprayed and everyone will have to find what works best for them. I am surprised Laurie can spray at 8 psi. None of my airbrushes work properly at that sort of pressure.


Cheers


Steve

 

[Laurie]

but when do you see an enamel user saying " my tip is clogging! ", or " my paint is splattering "?

Solved Patrick. Vallejo Flow Improver.


Just had a session this afternoon. 0.2 needle nozzle. Pressure 8PSI. Lifecolor. Vallejo Flow Improver. Put the lot in a cup and then was called away for 10 mins. Then spent 20 mins doing some effects so it was slow work with only short bursts which is the ideal time for acrylic paint to dry out. I have had problems, and frustration, carrying out this procedure before flow improver. But not a sign of a clog, no splatter, no pulling the needle out to clean no putting on a high PSI to clear the airbrush. It worked perfectly.


Both Vallejo and Lifcolor are forgiving. Overspray and they will flatten out. Mig Jimenez ( not sure why having a DVD is a sin) in his DVD on acrylic techniques shows how to achieve all the finishes which are associated with enamels but using acrylics. Some techniques are different to enamels but the finish is the same.


All of Vallejo Model Air and Lifecolor are non toxic. 95% of Vallejo Model are non toxic. I can hold a model piece and spray it and not worry that some gets on my fingers as it will wash off with water. If I drop some on the carpet water will wash it out. For me having tried Enamels first, when I started, I found it a drop of fresh air (literally as well) to find acrylics so easy to use. Any body new to model making should try both to find out which suits them in the end you can do the same with acrylics as can be obtained with enamels.


Laurie

 

[Ian M]

Get used to the Acrylics. I am sure that the EU will be putting the kabosh on Enamel paints in the not to distant future...(yet another reason to vote no when the day comes....)


Ian M

 

[john i am]

Ooooooooo the great debate. Enamels Vs Acrylic. I love acrylic paints but that doesn't really matter. I think its got more to do with the tools you are using. Cheap knockoffs or the quality engineered ones.I've had and used both and find that the more expensive brands work a lot better.

 

[PhilJ]

Looking at Revolution what type though
I want dual control but hare side feeders hence why I have my neo ( sh### ) oops sorry bout that


Revolution what type please


Regards Robert

John I have the H & S Evolution Silverline, it is top feed and mine was the solo version so you get the small cup and needle which is fine for 1:48 models which is all I have purchased so far.


The great thing about this AB is that it completely strips down (even with the cup being removable), is super easy to keep clean and has performed great so far and I have never used a AB before, I wanted something fairly decent that's easy to maintain and so far I'm well chuffed and feel I have made a good choice.


I will get the larger cup soon which costs around £10 I believe, this coupled with the Silverline solo will set you back about £100 - £110.


Maybe keep your Neo for priming only, I was thinking of getting one for this purpose and Alclad use.


Hope this helps.

 

[dubster72]

Solved Patrick. Vallejo Flow Improver.
Just had a session this afternoon. 0.2 needle nozzle. Pressure 8PSI. Lifecolor. Vallejo Flow Improver. Put the lot in a cup and then was called away for 10 mins. Then spent 20 mins doing some effects so it was slow work with only short bursts which is the ideal time for acrylic paint to dry out. I have had problems, and frustration, carrying out this procedure before flow improver. But not a sign of a clog, no splatter, no pulling the needle out to clean no putting on a high PSI to clear the airbrush. It worked perfectly.


Both Vallejo and Lifcolor are forgiving. Overspray and they will flatten out. Mig Jimenez ( not sure why having a DVD is a sin) in his DVD on acrylic techniques shows how to achieve all the finishes which are associated with enamels but using acrylics. Some techniques are different to enamels but the finish is the same.


All of Vallejo Model Air and Lifecolor are non toxic. 95% of Vallejo Model are non toxic. I can hold a model piece and spray it and not worry that some gets on my fingers as it will wash off with water. If I drop some on the carpet water will wash it out. For me having tried Enamels first, when I started, I found it a drop of fresh air (literally as well) to find acrylics so easy to use. Any body new to model making should try both to find out which suits them in the end you can do the same with acrylics as can be obtained with enamels.


Laurie

Yep I can do all that with a pot of enamel & some white spirit at much less cost!


And I didn't say owning the DVD was a sin.

 

[PhilJ]

John I have the H & S Evolution Silverline, it is top feed and mine was the solo version so you get the small cup and needle which is fine for 1:48 models which is all I have purchased so far.
The great thing about this AB is that it completely strips down (even with the cup being removable), is super easy to keep clean and has performed great so far and I have never used a AB before, I wanted something fairly decent that's easy to maintain and so far I'm well chuffed and feel I have made a good choice.


I will get the larger cup soon which costs around £10 I believe, this coupled with the Silverline solo will set you back about £100 - £110.


Maybe keep your Neo for priming only, I was thinking of getting one for this purpose and Alclad use.


Hope this helps.

Looking at Revolution what type though
I want dual control but hare side feeders hence why I have my neo ( sh### ) oops sorry bout that


Revolution what type please


Regards Robert

Sorry thats me being a idiot I just realised you said Revolution and not Evolution. I actually sold my wifes Iwata Revo to fund the H & S Evo as I looked into extensively and watched many videos. It's your choice at the end of the day but as I said the ease of maintenance did it for me.

 

[Robert1968]

Try getting an Iwata Revolution as a minimum if you can if you are thinking of another AB.
John

Looking at Revolution what type though


I want dual control but hare side feeders hence why I have my neo ( sh### ) oops sorry bout that


Revolution

Sorry thats me being a idiot I just realised you said Revolution and not Evolution. I actually sold my wifes Iwata Revo to fund the H & S Evo as I looked into extensively and watched many videos. It's your choice at the end of the day but as I said the ease of maintenance did it for me.

Well after speaking to laurie I will await my birthday next month and invest in an eclipse bs as it sounds an all rounder and with Teflon nib protector it should be good with all paint media


Robert

 

[Laurie]

I am surprised Laurie can spray at 8 psi. None of my airbrushes work properly at that sort of pressure.

Depends on what you are doing Steve. I have been using it to build up areas of differing subtle, I hope, colours. I used Lifecolor Acrylics not their Transform just the ordinary mix. 4 drops of Vallejo Flow improver about 6 drops thinners about 35% to 40% of the overall mix. The thin mix and low 8PSI enables great control over the amount of paint released which gives time, the all important advantage to build up paint as required. It is hardly noticeable that the paint film is building up. If at a greater PSI the paint would spew out at a greater rate and eventually spit and spurt.. It takes a long time to build a paint thickness which is ideal for effect work.


This is what I have achieved with the settings. Not an expert at this stuff this is just to illustrate what is achievable. The area shown is about 2" square It is the underside of a Jackal trying for a sand driven effect. Bit more work to be done yet.


View attachment 109658

 

[PhilJ]

Looking at Revolution what type though
I want dual control but hare side feeders hence why I have my neo ( sh### ) oops sorry bout that


Revolution


Well after speaking to laurie I will await my birthday next month and invest in an eclipse bs as it sounds an all rounder and with Teflon nib protector it should be good with all paint media


Robert

Yeah looks like the same class and make up of the H & S Evo Silverline but without the option for detachable/different cup size, you probably won't be disappointed by the looks of things

 

[john i am]

View attachment 109663

My iwata tr2 powered by the iwata smart jet pro which I can't recommend highly enough.. It sprays anything and everything at 20 psi for acrylic and about 12 psi for alclads.

It's never clogged spattered or splurged in the two years I've been using it .i hardly ever strip it down for cleaning just flush with cleaner after use.


And here we have my other tools which I've just had to fetch from the naughty cupboard and blow the dust of them to show them to you.I also have a neo (not in the picture) which as gone AWOL and will be executed on its return.


View attachment 109671

So please don't do what I did and waste your money on these save up and pay the extra and get something decent. I promise you won't regret it.

 

[Robert1968]

Yep been ther and done that ( I bought 4 Chinese ones 2 Malaysian side drawer ones and they all end up in bits as spares but mainly in bin


So bought myself a neo ( genuine ) not a imported one but now it's time to play with the big boys toys now


May have to wait 3 week or so for my birthday and keep the boss happy ( wife) the boss the banker whatever you wish to demote your love as she's Defoe the boss in this household


Robert

 

[Airfix Modeller Freak]

Looking at Revolution what type though
I want dual control but hare side feeders hence why I have my neo ( sh### ) oops sorry bout that


Revolution


Well after speaking to laurie I will await my birthday next month and invest in an eclipse bs as it sounds an all rounder and with Teflon nib protector it should be good with all paint media


Robert

I have an Eclipse HP-CS. This is a great airbrush, but I also use my High Performace for finer work


John

 

[Airfix Modeller Freak]

Balderdash!
Noxious vapours? Use a mask / spray booth (recommended for whatever paint types you use!)


Multiple acrylic paint brands = an empty wallet (especially including buying their proprietary thinners & cleaners)


It takes no longer to flush enamels than acrylics to start on a new colour.


Drying time... you've got me there, but I prefer to allow paint to cure rather than dry.


Acrylics are more popular granted, but when do you see an enamel user saying " my tip is clogging! ", or " my paint is splattering "?


Enamels : the past, present & future of great painting! ™

Lol


John

 

[CharleyGnarlyP290]

Hoo-ray! My first real post.


I use Vallejo Model Air paints exclusively. I use them straight from the bottle. no enhancers, retarders, thinners... nothing. I use a CO2 tank with a regulator on it. I set my psi at 15. Flawless results every time.


I recently did a German WWII camo scheme, quite intricate in fact, and it turned out great.


I have found that the spattering one gets, is usually from the tip beginning to dry out with little bits of partially dried paint coming off the tip. I have also heard that condensation in the compressor or line can cause spattering , as well. That is why I switched to a CO2 tank.


Forgot to add that i use a Pasche, single action airbrush

 

[Alan 45]

With all these problems you can get with AB I'm glad I use a brush it that goes wrong I know what the problem is , it's me :D

 

[demon]

Acrylics rule as I really don't want to find my Guinea pig getting high on fumes lol